ray.voith: My Mom had 4 brother that were dominican priests and 3 sisters that were dominican nuns - no objecttions when I wanted to join MKL Also no objections when I wanted to leave - I know my Mom agonized about whether she should be a nun, so she understood rpmeadows2003: I forgot about that Ray. My father was in the seminary for 6 years and his best friend had been a Maryknoll priest. My grandmother said "if only she could live to receive communion from my hand" (a tiny bit of guilt) rpmeadows2003: My parents were not that wild about me going...but I couldn't face getting a prom date. ray.voith: I think my grandmother (who died before I was born was obsessed with getting her kids into religious life hankeo7: I asked my parents about going to a seminary HS but they thought I was too young to make that kind of committment mocalouro: My sister was a nun and my dad talked about his wanting to be in the religious life. ray.voith: Bob and I joined the Venard the same year (Junior) from South Hills Catholic HS in Pgh - we met after we both joined - big high school rpmeadows2003: the vocational director from Cleveland came to see us and brought us together. --------------------------------------- rpmeadows2003: I remember when I got to the Venard, I was constipated for 3 days. That never happened to me before or really since hankeo7: Sometimes our bodies have to send us messages rpmeadows2003: I went to a workshop on trauma, entitled "Your body keeps score". It does. ray.voith: At the Venard reunion Hank Cooney was still worried whether he made the right decision about quiting - wasn' sure he wanted to come to the reunion - he was very glad he did --------------------------------------- ray.voith: When I was thinking about leaving GE - it was an agonizing decision - I remember crying in the stairwell thinking of leaving, and hoping noone would see me in that condotion. we were always told we were "cream of the crop" - maybe I wasn't worthy or selfish in quiting. I left at the end of the first semester of the Junior year at GE. I had become a "Loner" at GE that year mocalouro: Yes, agonizing fits the bill. What was being a loner like for you? ray.voith: Having a hard time going to the rec room and fitting in with conversations mocalouro: Loneliness was big for me. ray.voith: Mo - that's surprising to me since you always seemed (and seem) so outgoing with others ray.voith: I also had a hard time adjusting to the much larger class at GE versus Venard. - I didn't always mix well hankeo7: Ray you always seemed to have your act together ray.voith: It was an act mocalouro: I don't know Ray......I do know I felt smaller, less comfortable at GE ray.voith: I never felt that way at Venard - probably because of smaller classes mocalouro: the Venard was special that way. It was very small. ray.voith: we are all lonely to some degree - but in a deeper sense, all the same - hard to see that when young rpmeadows2003: We had about 110 new guys that started at GE rpmeadows2003: I think we were all scared. I was and missed my family, altho could hardly feel that. hankeo7: When I was a Freshman at GE I didn't know anyone. But discovered quickly that there were about 20 guys that had gone to school together hankeo7: They seemed to have friends, know things and were insiders mocalouro: Ray, I have heard that reaction from others........yet inside there was discomfort, one way to say that was loneliness. ray.voith: I think at GE, maybe with good reason, new students may have felt that we acted "uppity" about having been at the Venard, although I don't think I ever felt I was any better than the new guys ray.voith: Hank - do you mean they went to school with you? I wasn't aware of that group - who were they? (I asked this naive question, not making the connection to us Venarders. I guess I didn't think of us Venarders as insiders or special.) mocalouro: Hank are you talking about Venard guys? hankeo7: The group was the folks from the Venard and to a lesser extent Mt View and Chesterfield hankeo7: It seemed to me that they had a head start but I didn't feel as though they were lording it over us new guys. --------------------------------------------------- ray.voith: I do think that the seminary warning about "particular friendships" caused us Venard guys to drift apart somewhat mocalouro: That friendship thing was a pain in the ass rpmeadows2003: I agree with you Ray. It added fear of doing something wrong. mocalouro: Ray, you feel that the Venard guys were cautious because of the friendship rule.? ray.voith: Yes - I think so - plus in reality it is not a good idea for such a group to just stick together and not branch out. ray.voith: Just was difficult for me --------------------------------------------------- mocalouro: Left after GE rpmeadows2003: I was sad when you guys left. rpmeadows2003: Who were you close to in Sr. year, Hank? hankeo7: Closest to Lynch and Bill Murphy and you Bob rpmeadows2003: I say Lynch at Cape May one year. He was sculpturing (marble statues) hankeo7: Jerry was a very good artist and had a reputation. but unfortunately died a few years ago rpmeadows2003: I'm sorry to hear that. He was the first person I saw cry when leaving Hingham. I was very touched by that. ray.voith: I heard that Hingham was especially difficult for many mocalouro: Intense times ray.voith: Did any of you make it past novitiate? hankeo7: Left Hingham in November rpmeadows2003: I left on the Immaculate Conception feastday in December from Hingham hankeo7: Just two weeks later! rpmeadows2003: what was Hingham like for you Hank? hankeo7: Everything happened so fast hankeo7: Spent so much time alone in my room just thinking mocalouro: Lots of quiet time at Hingham? rpmeadows2003: I felt I was a quitter and only really seriously thought of leaving in the last month in Maryknoll. Altho a priest at Hingham thought I would be a good used car salesman. hankeo7: I didn't have any close friends at GE until senior year then got closer to a few guys hankeo7: I felt like I was drifting hankeo7: Guys were leaving. Couldn't get over the feeling that I wouldn't be happy in the celibate life mocalouro: Celibacy and loneliness were tough for me. hankeo7: When I went to talk about my feelings, I was out the door mocalouro: Hank, can you tell us more about feelings and out the door? rpmeadows2003: It was the atmosphere. Men are socialized to be afraid of too much closeness, to be tough, not feel plus Irish Catholic puritanism. We were idealistic, mostly kind in some ways, but womenly affection wasn't present or talking about feelings. rpmeadows2003: Vulnerability or crying or sharing feelings like today wasn't encouraged. The priests didn't know how to do it. rpmeadows2003: I wanted to experience life and told myself that I could try it for two years and then perhaps come back mocalouro: Hank, please explain that about talking feelings ray.voith: I heard one priest was especially annoying with the students at Hingham hankeo7: Jacobs told me that he had prepared a list of reasons why he wanted to leave Hingham before he went to see Cronin but Cronin didn't want to hear them just made the arrangements for Bill to leave the next day. rpmeadows2003: Fr. McCormick was especially tough and I don't think kind. I had a big argument with him one time. maybe the priests felt stuck and were jealous of people leaving mocalouro: Bob what was the argument about? hankeo7: Bob do you remember a big debate among the students at Hingham on whether we should "have to " go to mass every day? rpmeadows2003: I had worked in the South on civil rights that summer before with Neary and Casey. It looked like to me that poeple were struggling and some looked sad. McCormick said that Blacks had rhythm in their bones and other stereotypes. I said that I didn't see that. I t went on for quite a while rpmeadows2003: Hank, I first brought up that question to the student council. I didn't want to be forced to go to Mass. It dropped however and then I think Pete Loan or someone brought it back up. We argued a whole night about it, then voted. It was tied, then Frank Breen broke the tie saying not to bring it up to McCormick. (maybe comparing ceremony (Mass, etc) vs action in community - which is more important hankeo7: I started to feel that I couldn't be happy as a priest and that life as a husband and father was what I really yearned for rpmeadows2003: I think I numbed myself to what I was feeling. Fr. Kennedy was a big help to me. mocalouro: Same here, Bob. ray.voith: Unfortunately I never got to know Fr Kennedy well or Fr D'Arcy. rpmeadows2003: Kennedy was the best teacher I had at GE and influenced the profession I do today ------------------------------- ray.voith: So - one thing is clear today that was not so clear back then - we all had similar problems ray.voith: Having said all these things, going to seminary was a major formative thing in my life - away from home, seeing a bigger world (even though in some ways sheltered) mocalouro: Same here, Ray, bigtime. hankeo7: Definitely, I think there were values established that have lasted my entire life